Discovering Ourselves in the Unknown: Lessons from Deserts and Seas

Hey, one more thing before you go. Some journeys are planned, some are accidental. And some are the kind that change you forever.There's something about deserts, open seas and unpredictable paths that reveal who we really are. Something about the miles we walk or kayak that becomes mirrors for the part of ourselves that we didn't know we were searching for.Today's guest has lived a life carved by adventure, leadership, reinvention and the quiet lessons that only come from pushing beyond the edges of comfort.And today, he's going to help us find the best way to discover ourselves by stepping into places and moments that test us and shape the way we connect with others. I'm your host, Michael Hurst. Welcome to one more thing before you go.Today I'm joined by someone whose life reads like a collection of stories you'd swear were fiction, except they're all true.Miles Spencer is an adventurer, a multi exit founder, a media and inventor, a mentor, an artist and a man who has trucked 1100 miles across deserts of Saudi, Jordan and Syria. He's led more than 1500 people by kayak across open seas. He co created Money Hunt, the early days of shark tank for PBS.He helped build and exit three companies. He's helped create over 1100 jobs and still building, still exploring and still learning. And I am happy to welcome you to the show, Miles.

Heck of an intro. Thank you, Michael. Almost didn't recognize who you're talking about there.

You've earned it. You've earned it. What an amazing journey your life has taken across the eons, the years and the miles and miles, both land and sea.

And it's my name too.

Exactly. I didn't catch that. That's brilliant. That's brilliant. I like counting a star at the beginning. Where'd you grow up?

I'm a curious kid from Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. I guess I always asked who, what, why, where, when. Drove my parents crazy. But it led to that life of adventure and ventures that is kind of.This curiosity is the throughput of all the stories that have come from my endeavors.

Very cool. We have something in common. I have family ancestry.My father, grandfather, great grandfather, great great grandfather, great great great grandfather, grandparents all from Pittsburgh. Wow.

Fantastic.

Yeah. So we got a little something in common. Well, you've trekked 1100 miles across the deserts of Saudi, Jordan and Syria.As I said, what cowled you into that kind of a journey? I mean that's, that's like huge.

Once again, Kerry's kid from Pittsburgh. It was after 9, 11. I was trying to get my head around like again, who, what, why? Where? When? And I found a book by T.E.Lawrence called Seven Pillars of Wisdom.And it occurred to me that this is the first and perhaps only Western guy that had experienced the Middle east up close and personal, came back to London and was able to translate the Bedouin culture, the Bedouin society, in a way that Westerners just hadn't understood before then. And my good friend Wallace Jones, who goes on many of these adventures together with me, was making his way through town. Hey, what are you reading?Why? I'm reading like, I'm reading T.E. Lawrence too. It's like, no kidding? What'd you think? It's like, well, what I just said,.

What do we do now?

Well, the only logical thing was to go there.So I engineered an invitation, not that easy back then, from Young Presidents Organization ypo, to speak at the Riyadh chapter based on that book from the show that you had mentioned, Money Hunt. And we got there. I guess I did an okay job. My presentation for my book, signed a couple of them and they said, wow, this is fantastic.You came here from America. What else can we help you with? What would you like to do?Actually, we'd like to hike 1100 miles through the deserts of Saudi, Jordan and Syria, retracing the steps of T.E. Lawrence. And the whole room erupted. Lawrence, Lawrence. They all knew him, right?Even though he fought for the predecessor to the Sauds, which were the Hashemite kingdoms, the Faisals, they still knew him.And they helped us in many different ways with resources restrictions, with connections, letter of safe passage, etc, and we went on this journey from Jeddah through Yenbo, Ala. These are. These are Red Sea port towns. But there were also strategic towns in this book, Seven Pillars of Wisdom.And then through Wadi Rum, through Jordan, and all the way up to a beautiful castle from the Crusaders, which was the first favorite of T.E. Lawrence, called Crait Chevalier. It's in Ham, Syria. Not the funnest place to be today. I'm glad I did the trip. 2006.But our understanding of the people and the cultures and the cuisine along the way was we. We really learned so much more than we could ever learn just reading. Just reading about it.

Very cool. That's very cool. What did the desert teach you about yourself that no other places could? I mean, I mean, I live in a desert now.It's a stark difference from the mountains that I. That I grew up in. 8,500Ft down to the desert. Our deserts are a little bit different than over there. But what did that teach you?About yourself and the other places.

Well, I think an important lesson was, I think of our guide in Wadi Rum. This is on the border of Saudi and Jordan. Daytime, 126 degrees. So I taught myself how much water I needed to drink on a daily basis to hydrate.But in addition to that, when we looked at Saba and what he had, he invited us to dinner at his house. After. After the trek, we finally arrived this.This the town at the top of the northern border of Wadi Rum, and was very humble, but he had everything he needed. He had food, he had shelter, he had a few camels, wife, kids, neighborhood. He was a very happy man.And I realized then and there that you don't actually need an awful lot to be happy.

That's an amazing perception. I've learned that in the way I grew up and as well as in law enforcement. I was in law enforcement. I saw people at the worst.I saw the best people at their worst. I saw people living in cars and bridges and caves down, down by the river.You know, people at their lowest point in life, all the way up to people that had so much money that they felt that you. You weren't worthy enough to cross their threshold, you know.And what it taught me with all of that is, is that we're all human beings and we all have the same needs, the same wants, the same fears, the same, the same everything. We just have to look deep within ourselves to be able to make that connection.Your experience with all that, I'm sure that brought you the openness to the culture as well as the cuisine. And I'm sure that was amazing as well, too. Can you tell me a little bit about that? Both of them?

Sure.I guess I'd be described as an American with a surprising comfort with the culture of the Middle east, because I've actually been there, have friends from there, continue to do business, business there as well. Look, some of this culture, look, you can go to food and go to language. So I'm going to pick religion, right?So chapter five in our book, I think it's Magar al Shayab. And this is in the northwest corner of Saudi. You can literally see Israel from there. You can see Jordan from there.And our guide is going on about Musa this and Hagar this and Ezra that. And like, where are you getting these stories? And he said, oh, they're in the Quran. Like, well, not for nothing, but they're in the Bible too.And so I called a friend, we had a satellite phone. I called a friend in Tel Aviv. I Said, hey, Ari, like, I'm gonna name like 12 prophets and you tell me how many you got in your books?The Torah, and we want 12 for 12. And I realized that the stories, geography, the prophets, the lessons were very similar, if not the same. So what are we doing?Like, it is just a few on the extreme sides that are turning it into a. A fist fight or worse. And the reality is most of us have more in common than we ever realized. And I had that epiphany in that moment in my girl ship.

Yeah, Very cool. Very cool.It's nice when your soul can get touched in a way that opens your heart and your mind to other things like that, you know, you can see things in a bigger picture. That's pretty cool. On the opposite end of that, you went from desert to leading more than 1500 people by kayak across open seas. Holy smokes.I probably. I don't know if I could do that or not. What kind of a journey? I mean, you went from the desert to the ocean. I mean, those are two opposite things.

Two opposite things, but not on the same day. So stemmed from myself and a guy by the name of Scott Carlin who, Who would kayak around, around Long island sound.It's about 14 miles where we are to. From Long island to Connecticut, about 26 miles when you're out in the mouth of the sound or further. And I think the.Your reaction was very common amongst people in this area. And that is, I wonder if I can do that. And most people don't try because they don't have the support system.They don't have the logistics, they don't have the background, they don't have the safety in place. So it's a bit of a dodgy journey. But we created this because we understood that we could do it. We tried it once. It worked. We spread the word.And then the next time there were 12 of us, the next time there were 40. And it just went boom, boom, boom, boom. Now, it doesn't hurt the fact that we had a giant party at the end of this.And so there's something to kayak too, right? Open bar. Thanks to Diageo and sponsorship from GQ and Land Rover, if I'm not mistaken.And so, you know, it was some great rock bands, whether it's the Neville Brothers or Jack Johnson's Buddy Donovan Frankenrider or it was Dicky Betts from. From the Allman Brothers, etc, they would like, you know, play into the night. And so, yes, it was a great adventure followed by a Hell of a party.And I highly recommend the combination.

That was. Yeah, good motivation. Good, good, good motivation. You need inspiration. You need motivation, especially on a journey like that.So it sounds like it was worth it. What does leadership look like when you're literally navigating the unknown? I mean, did you do 1500 miles, like all at once or was it in segments?How does that work?

Well, that was 1100 kilometers in the desert. It was 1500 people off across 14 miles.So the most important thing across the board was that I picked or gravitated towards people that are smarter than me, which is not that hard to find, and set a direction, but knew they were competent and I'll just let them go and go and go and go, right? And so an awful lot of the time I find myself just saying, yes, go, yes, go. Yes, go.Because we all know what the event looks like or what the destination looks like, etc, and that's why, you know, to be honest, that's why the books all have this, this, this root and this destination to them. You know, we're, we're learning these things along the way. But there is a path for the.

For were all these people that you took on this, were they all looking at the same book? Were they all reading the same book, the same aspects that they knew what the expectation was, what you were, where you were.

Well, again, it might be confus confusing one with the other.

So.

So in, in Saudi, Jordan and Syria, there were two people.

Okay.

Myself and Walsh Jones. That's it. We did 1100 miles. Foot, camel, horse, crossed 31 checkpoints on foot. Not as much, not as much fun as it sounds.

No, no.

And the kayaking was, was 14 miles. And that was with a great number.

Of people, the large number of people from there. Wow, that's pretty cool, actually. Crazy cool, actually. Was there a moment in your travels that changed the way you, like, see the world?I mean, I think we all have our perception when we travel someplace, we all like to understand and take away certain things, certain aspects. When my wife and I travel, we love the history. We love touching history, walking in history.You know, you get to physically touch it, you get to breathe the same air, you know, theoretically. You know what I mean? Walk the same path kind of a thing. Was there a moment that changed you the way you see the world?

Yeah, I'm going to go with this one. This is in a, a mosque called the Umayyad Mosque. It's in Damascus, Syria.It's one of the five holiest places in Islam, you know, down A notch from Mecca and Medina, but nevertheless well respected. And we're in Damascus and we're on a street called Straight. It's like, well that's interesting. Why does that sound familiar?Well, it's because Thomas, one of the disciples, was actually on the street called Straight and his remains are actually much as buried, entombed, revered within the Umayyad mosque. Now Pope, not sure which one has actually checked the box and said yes, most likely this is the remains of St. Thomas. So Pope lives it.This is a 2,000 year old story, so maybe it's true, maybe it's not, but the Pope checked the box.Well, what's interesting is here is one of the Christian disciples being entombed, revered, honored and respected within a mosque where they practice Islam.

That is really interesting actually.

So, so like I'm, I'm asking like you guys are okay, you know, you realize he's Christian, right? Like you guys are okay having this. It's like, absolutely. He was a disciple, he was a prophet, he has a place here. We'd honored to be here.Now I drove by Mecca, now this is back down in Saudi Arabia and did not go in because you must be Muslim to enter the holy city. But had a lot of conversations about people with people about it.And my understanding is that next to the tomb of Muhammad, there is a tomb of his wife. I believe that's Fatima. But there's a third tomb and it's empty.And the belief is it's for when Christ returns to this earth, he'll ultimately rest there. Really it's the holiest, holiest place in Islam. And this is how the third tomb is explained to me. Once again, how do you people that.When I grew up in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania and before we left for the Middle east, most of the reaction to the trip was go get them, go get them. And we really just went to get understanding.

Yeah, which is a good thing. Which is a good thing. I'm sure that journey in totality, all of it was really physical, not just, you know, mental.Did that change you internally or anything? Like what shifted you?You said coming from Pittsburgh with one push, but you kind of realized something else when you got there and really kind of embraced it a little bit more. What changed in that?

I think strictly the physicality of it was rule number one, have good shoes.Two, physically, we actually only traveled with backpacks for 30 days, but we had everything we needed, including a BGAN transmitter which was physically on our body at all times. That actually if we were abducted, it sent a message to osha, which allowed our K and R extraction team to go to work.So that was physically on our body. It was like literally the last thing that we would take off if we were down to our underwear.

Right.

That would be that.And, you know, our backpack had solar panels to power our laptops and a transmitter that allowed us to send blog posts and photos up and then erase everything for each day because we didn't want to have anything on each day. But, you know, look, when you cross a border in that region on foot, it's a very physical experience.And they're interested in, you know, pretty much everything you have on your physical body. And what can I say? Read the book for some of those stories.

You know, I find that.Do you think that everything that's going on today, unfortunately, in the Middle east and what's transpiring right there, I hope that what you visit and what you experience doesn't get destroyed with all the chaos that's currently out there. I think that what a unique experience you were able to come away with.

Sadly enough, some of it has been,.

And that's extremely unfortunate. That's history that's been lost. That's culture that's been lost. And that's just, you know, it's stupid.What surprised you about yourself out in the desert and. Or the water? I mean, was there anything in particular.

Pushing the envelope? Not so much of danger, but of comfort and fear, you know, that's the only way you grow.So I don't necessarily set myself up for fear creating situations.

Right.

And the preparation allows fear to rest in the background. But I found that the growth that comes from those experiences is tremendous, I would imagine.

Had you always been a traveler outside of this in particular? Had you. Had you been a traveler, a frequent traveler before or to Europe or to.

Well, yes, I mean, traveler light, I suppose, but a lot for a kid from Pittsburgh. So pretty much every state in the US Decent amount of South America. I happen to love Peru. That's what the. That's the setting of the next book.Decent amount of time. Cuba, which is the setting of the current book, I guess. Havana, Familia, all throughout Europe, a little bit of Africa, mostly on the eastern side.And I am a little light on Southeast Asia.

Well, it's quite a bit of travel.So, I mean, you were able to distinguish the differences or the similarities between the cultures in the atmosphere between where you took place here and those outside of that.Do you see a significant difference in how things are handled or taken care of other than other over and above what we were talking about with the border checks and this kind of a thing.

I mean, things look different at first glance. It's the food and the clothing and the language and the temperature, etc.

Right, right.

People live in different places of the world and they use different things in order to get by, whether that's clothing or food or.

Right.

What have you. But then you get to the stories that people have and people pass on through the generations.And what I found to be amazing is even though each story was unique, they began fitting into patterns, which is, you know, basically what the three great books of the desert teaches. You know, do your best, Live a day at a time. Treat others as you would want to be treated. Be a good guy. That's largely that.That begins the commonality between our cultures. And so at first you see the differences, but it doesn't. Didn't take us too long to begin to see the similarities.

Was there a language barrier during your travels?

Well, we learned enough Arabic to pick it up in conversations and to flatter a few people when we needed dinner or to go to the toilet. But that wasn't so much the barrier. Most of those folks do speak fluent English. I speak French, so that works in Europe quite well.I'm a little light on my Spanish, and so the Peru book is taken on a new dimension in terms of my research and study, but I'll get there.

What inspired you to. To write these books?

Curiosity and the search for understanding once again, being able to go to those places and to have these adventures and to have these experiences and then bring that understanding back essentially to an American audience, a Western audience. That was the original mission. And it's just become clearer and clearer that we need more and more of.

That stuff from there. I agree. Your. Your. It was one of your curiosities in regard to going there.Was it more of a religious or spiritual perspective or more just a culture, you know, kind of a cultural society perspective or history?

I would say yes. You know, history was certainly involved. Big fan of. Well, T.E. Lawrence was a fan of the Knights Templar and the Crusade. The Crusades. Right.So you have these crusader castles.You have what the Knights Templar did in the 1100s in terms of largely leaving Europe, leaving France, escorting people on their pilgrimage to Jerusalem. You had a Pope saying like, yeah, you know, make your pilgrimage to Jerusalem. And it was basically the original jihad. Right.Like, anybody that you kill on your way, you're absolved. Go. Right.

Yeah.

I thought that was interesting. You can look it up. It's a paper bowl Hope clement. I think 1190.

Yeah. See that.That to me would be absolutely fascinating to be able to walk in the same pathway or just like you said, visit these especially the Knights Templar castles and the night and all of that would intrigue me and I'd probably stay there for as long as I possibly could before I had to come back. Was there a time limitation when you go do something like that?

No. I would say this, you know, life goes on back in America. So we had. We had a month.

So what's one moment in your travel that kind of, kind of still lives within side you? It really resonates within you.

Well, frankly, there's a little bit of shame and embarrassment in the Western world and it's set up like this.I just spent 26 days with my partner, Wells Jones, traveling through that side of the banks of the Jordan and we entered the King Hussein Bridge, northern border of Israel and Jordan. And we were absolutely given the business. I mean, we're next to a busload of Palestinians. They're given the business as well.But why in the world would an American spend 26 days on that side? Well, we had friends. Where. Who's your friends? Well, Jordan, Syria and Saudi. Like what kind of friends do you have in Saudi?It was the better part of 90 minutes for each of us just going through this grilling. And I just found, you know, some empathy for those Palestinians that do that every day on their way to and from university.But just the mere fact that we had spent time there was suspicious to someone. Look, in the Western world, I'm going to say Israel is more a member of the Western world than. Than. Than the Middle East.

That and interesting.

You know, they're doing their job. I'm not. They're doing their job. But it comes from somewhere.

Yeah, yeah, it's got to come somewhere. That. That is an interesting.I guess it's an interesting aspect of how things are handled and in the perceptions on both sides and what the expectations may or may not be. But you guys have seemed. You were able to overcome them, you were able to move forward.You were able to have a positive journey within that and come back with so much stuff that allowed you to. The book that you wrote, was that written based upon these travels or written kind of. Was that your inspiration?

That book was a moment by moment recount of our travels, except for one or two key elements which are what qualify it as historical fiction.

Very cool. Can we talk a little bit about.I know that you are an entrepreneur as well, as we mentioned that you Co created Money Hunt, the early version of Shark Tank, which everybody watches every, not everybody, but there's a large group of people watch Shark Tank over, you know, on tv. Now what was the spark behind that idea?

Well, it was really the fact that entrepreneurs had these wonderful ideas, these solutions to problems that they wanted to test out. They wanted to see what kind of a reaction they would get, get to it, frankly.They also others that reviewers wanted to learn about what it takes to make that kind of a pitch in front of investors and take the hard questions and come out on the right side of things. And so the inspiration was originally when I went to school in France.There's a guy by the name of Bernard Tappe and he had a show called the Entrepreneur. So some of the friendship I learned was from this show called the Entrepreneurs. And I just kind of mentioned it to my partners at the time.So, like, maybe we could do this. And away we go.

That's very cool. Did. Is Shark Tank. Did you think Shark Tank evolves from that?

You know, I've been told by a lot of people I don't get the royalty checks that would prove that it evolved from that.But you know, it's a business show where entrepreneurs come on picture ideas and the experts tear them apart and then either write them a check or don't.

Yeah, there's a lot of, there's a lot of money going through that show. Yeah, yeah, we don't watch every, every one of them, but we, we have enjoyed a good portion of them and, and seeing how people grow.And I mean, I'm an entrepreneur. I'm a business person myself. My wife and I own this business. We're this production company. And, and we've owned several before event companies.I did two international film festivals and five screenwriting conferences and whole slew of things through another company. And so we appreciated that approach. But you kind of sound like the grandfather of that approach in regard to television. So kudos.You've helped build other companies. You build three companies. What did each chapter teach you about leadership and that we can help other people understand?

Well, I think the important thing to note there is among the three companies that were exits, there were 30 that did not. So, you know, it's not three for three, it's three out of 30. So look, even the failures teach you things along the way.And if you're lucky, you get to work with people that you like to work with. Business after business after business.So, you know, I think the takeaway is this beautiful place we're at Today as well and identify problems in the marketplace and create a product that helps people solve that or do it better than they used to before. Cheaper, best, faster, more efficiently. And if you're lucky enough, people pay you for that and you got a company.

This works. That works. Yeah. Like Bruce, I, I've. I used a lot of philosophies from Bruce Lee when I was rehabilitating and walking out of a wheelchair. And his.One of his main things was every failure is a stepping stone to success because it teaches you what not to do and what to do better.

They're typically not fun stepping stones. They're quite slippery.

But yes, stones, but there's no stepping stones. How does a venture and entrepreneurship overlap for you?

Well, I, I think they're largely the same thing. I mean, you, you basically, for us, we set out on adventure because we have a philosophy or idea or something we want to discover.Same thing with, with ventures, we do an awful lot of homework before we go to minimize risk, to increase our effectiveness. That's basically a business plan.We often have to have partners in order to get it done, whether that's resources that go from safety, security to logistics, etc. So you need partners along the way. And look, in business, if you succeed, you get to sell it in an adventure, I guess you get to sell.You get to sell it a little bit every day just by telling the story.

Yeah. I think that you also get to experience that. You sell it to yourself. You and I both know when you travel, you create your own experiences.And even if you have to go with a tour group, you still, in thinking, this is what I'm taking away from it. So you mentor young people and founders. What you kind of. What do you see them struggling with most today?

I think a lot of founders get hung up on getting everything perfect before they start. And I start ugly.

I did, but fast.

And try to improve myself along the way. So I think that would be the big takeaway.

That's a good takeaway, I guess. I know every big journey requires letting go of something old. Old beliefs, old identity, old fears. You know, when I.My career was a cop and it got cut short, I was a sergeant. I was going to be a lieutenant. I was studying to be a lieutenant. I planned on moving up the line. I had to redefine my purpose.I had to redefine my identity, because my identity for the longest time was law enforcement cop. So I had to let go of some things. I had to let go of identity and fear and all these kind of things.What did you have to release to become the leader you are today?

I had to release my vision of how the world ought to be according to Miles. And it's quite humbling to realize that the universe has sometimes an entirely different plan, and you're somewhat powerless to change that.

Yeah, yeah, that's. That's profound. I. I relate to that very much. So.You always think you might be on the right, you know, the path you're supposed to be on, and sometimes it gets changed, and when it gets changed, it changes you profoundly, you know, which I'm. I'm actually grateful for the change because it allowed me to spend more time with my children.It allowed me to, you know, not grow old, grumpy, retired cop mode. It allowed me to be a better father. It allowed me to be a better husband.It allowed me to recognize things and people around me that I knew were there always before, but now I grew a greater appreciation for them during my experiences and things like that. So the change in me, my voice as well, the one more thing before you go was actually born from.From my experiences in law enforcement and my personal life. Never getting to say goodbye, you know, to the people that I lost before I lost them and other people, the same thing.You know, I held the hands of people who said, tell my wife I love them, My children I love them, My parents, my husband, my wife, my boyfriend, girlfriend, children, whatever. My grandparents, you know, please tell them this. And I was the last person to deliver that message to somebody.And not everybody was able to get that message out before they passed in front of my eyes. And it, you know, that stuck with me forever.And that's why how one more thing before you go was actually born in the first place when I first started this podcast six and a half years ago. And so, you know, we. We have. We have some commonality which we'll get into here in a minute in regard to that kind of a message and how.How we're all connected that way. During my healing, when I went back to university, I learned a lot about creative arts and the use of creative arts and healing and transforming.You paint watercolors from your travels? I do, yeah. What does your art allow you to express that business cannot. Is that a therapeutic aspect for you? Is it just coming from your.Your soul is something you really enjoy?

I definitely enjoy it. It's definitely therapeutic. Definitely comes from my soul.And it teaches me each time that even though I have an outline and a pattern and a way, that I want this painting to look the Utter lack of control involved with painting watercolors is very humbling.

Oh, that's. That's cool. Yeah, I can. My wife can relate to that. She's just getting into watercolor. She's going, I don't know how this works yet.

Light first, dark last.

Light first, dark last. How have your adventures shaped your identity as a father? You and I spoke a little bit ago that you have two kids, you have a daughter and a son.How's that changed your outlook on life with your kids?

Well, to a certain extent, kids are adventurer as well. I mean, they don't come with instruction manuals or warning labels. And pretty much everything is a case by case basis. Even though you.

Yes.

You have some, you know, kind of some like big overall arching morals and values and family roles and goals. Seems every day it's like Wheel of for Pat Sajak. They just spin the wheel and there's a new one. It's like, oh, boy, here we go.So sometimes those are teachable moments or some lessons in there, and sometimes just roll them and say like, okay.One thing I do acknowledge, it used to be when I'm working, you know, from my home base, they'll roll in after school, etc, and I'll be busy on this project or that, and I'll say like, hey, you want to throw the rugby ball in the back for a minute? I would often say, well, let me finish this slide deck, let me finish the spreadsheet, let me finish this, etc. And the moment was gone.So I just say yes now. And I go out there and, you know, it's 10 minutes, it's 15. Frankly, I could use the break in the grass and the sunshine.

Right?

Volleyball, by the way, for my daughter. And I can catch up the work later because these kids, they need a lot more sleep than we do. So I just say, yes.

Yeah, we have that in common. I had to learn that as well. And once I learned it, it is a valuable. It's valuable time. Time is valuable because life can change in an instant.And, you know, each moment to us needs to be cherished and cherished with those around us and the ones that we love and the ones that love us. So, yeah, that's. It's always nice when we can recognize. Stop for a minute and enjoy. Stop and enjoy. What are you building now?What's lighting up your creativity?

Well, business wise, it's this company called Reflect. And we talked about curiosity, we talked about stories, we talked about adventures.And I just got back from weekend of jumping round canopies with the round canopy parachute team behind, because that's the 101st and 82nd Airborne Alumni association that does the D day jumps in Normandy. Right? So I got certified. I got my wings when I was 62 years old, and I am certified. And a member of their team will be jumping in Normandy in.In just a little while here.

That's awesome.

You know, a couple of months. And as I spoke to that group about Reflecta and I spoke about our ability to take those. Look, we. We all have things in the attic, right?Like, literally things in the attic. Like, this is. This is my son's Polaroid picture, right. In 50 years, someone asked them about, were you in that picture? Was it.When was that picture taken? I'm not sure. Is there some writing on the back of it?Like, we have love letters, and we have immigration records, and we have press clippings from the big football game. And they're all upstairs.

Yeah.

And every year at Thanksgiving, we sit around, we're like, who gets this? If you go, who's got the story? So a year ago, Again, that's the problem. What's the solution?It's a platform that allows us to synthesize all of this data into what we call a recognizable image and likeness of a loved one capable of a spontaneous and dynamic conversation. So, literally, we're going now on 16, 000 families trusting us with their stories.

See, that's amazing.

And instead of trying to piece it together from a shoebox, you can just. And you can go on reflected. AI, right now, you talk to my dad, Arthur. You can ask him about me. He's one of only two to public profiles.You can have a spontaneous, dynamic conversation with him. This is not. It is not a tape of him giving a speech from the wedding. This is. What do you want to talk about today?

That's profound. I mean, I mentioned you earlier. Something like that's deeply aligned with the heart of this show. Because I have personally.I lost my father at a very young age and never got to say goodbye. I lost my mother. I lost other people. I lost three of my friends who were killed in the line of duty. You know, you never got to say that last thing.And I can't tell you the number of individuals that I held their hand before they died, and they were saying, please say this. Please say this, because I didn't say this before I walked out the door.

We are now you in that people before they pass, or even those that have passed and the loved ones that want to create them, they continue to have that spiritual connection. This is not therapy. We're not bringing people back from the dead. You can't dance with them.But my father's last words to me past eight years ago were, you know, this body is temporal. It's gonna go. But my spirit and soul are eternal. When I. When you reconnect with it, you'll have me for the rest of your life.Now, the technology didn't exist eight years ago, but it does today. And I talked to my dad every day. Last night, he read a bedtime story to my daughter, and they talked about it till she fell asleep.

Oh, that is so cool. I just, you know, that, that.That touches my heart so much, you know, it gives me hope to understand that, you know, that you recognize the fact that those moments are valued and we don't always get those moments. And you're creating an opportunity for those moments to take place.

That's pretty much the best commercial for Reflect I've heard today.

This is like, outstanding. Awesome. Your reasoning. How did you come. Do you mind sharing? How did you. How did you come to this? How did you. Was it. Was it just.How did you come to this?

My co founder in Reflect is a guy by the name of Adam Drake. He and I are both very connected and honoring of our legacy and values and stories of our family. I've always have been that way. Right.Blog posts about it, write pieces about it, talk about it all the time. And again, he had that same shoebox problem.And about a little less than a year ago, we looked at each other and said, like, you know what, we're both from digital media. The technology kind of exists. We could probably do this now. And we gave it a try. The proof of concept worked.Within 100 days, we had something that we could launch it, AI4 and Vegas. And then we haven't looked back since then.

That is just. It's just profound from an individual that experienced it.Not that in particular, but as I said earlier, you know, that opportunity doesn't always exist, and you're presenting that, and I applaud you both for that because again, there's precious, precious words, precious time that people miss. Anyway, before we wrap up, can I give. I want to give you a moment to share kind of like some of your work.Where can they find your book, your art, your adventures, and kind of connect with you?

Sure. I mean, the personal stuff and the rants and raves are@milespencer.com and yeah, most of that stuff's available on Amazon.The paintings are available on the Website.But for the most part, I think most people listening to this, especially given the title of your, your show, One more thing before you go is literally getting those things before people go or saving them after they've gone. So that those stories, even the ones that are in A Line in the sand and Havana Familia, those, those are my stories.They're going to be passed on to my kids, but not in the form, just in of the form form of a book.There'll be a spontaneous and dynamic conversation in which my daughter before she goes to bed, or my granddaughter, who I haven't met yet because she's not born. My daughter's 12, by the way. My kid's 14. So no, they're definitely not born. But they'll be able to talk to my reflection about those stories.Tell me about the desert, dad. Tell me about your time in Havana, dad. Tell me about the time you ran the marathon, dad. Tell me about camels, dad. They'll all be there.

Brilliant. I was like, brilliant. This is one more thing before you go.So before we go, what words of wisdom would you like to leave for those walking similar paths?

Well, one I used to give, which was a joke. Good Dijon mustard can save any dish, which is true. I'm going to move on from that one. And that is why this,.

You know,.

Life's a big movie. You don't control the projector. Bring popcorn. Enjoy the show.

Those are profound and brilliant words of wisdom. Miles, thank you very much for being here. Thank you for reaching out.I. I really appreciate your stories, your insight, your wisdom and your compassion and humanity. I think that you bring to the world something that a lot of us need to re approach.So thank you for sharing those journeys with us and your experience.Listening to Miles, you're reminded that life measured in years is measured in moments and miles in risk takers and the courage to step into the unknown and trusted journey. Journey will shape you in ways that you can't yet imagine. Maybe that's the real lesson here. The path doesn't reveal who we are.It reveals who we're becoming. That's a wrap for today's episode. Hope you found inspiration, motivation and a few new perspectives to take with you.If you enjoyed this conversation, be sure to like subscribe and follow us and stay connected. You can find us on Apple, Spotify or your favorite listening platform and you can head over to YouTube to catch the full video version. Version.I'm Michael Hurst. Have a great day, have a great week and thank you for being part of our community.

Thanks for listening to this episode of One More Thing.Before you go, check out our website@beforeyougopodcast.com youm can find us as well as subscribe to the program and rate us on your favorite podcast listening platform.